ÆTHELMEARC COLLEGE OF HERALDS - commentary archive
Letter of Intent #39
Debatale Lands Commenting Group

Unto Dagonell, Garnet Herald, and all others to whom this may come doth
Juliana de Luna send greetings!

These are the comments on the AEthelmearc Internal Letter of Intent
A39. Sorry they're at the last minute - we had a late meeting this
month, and I just finished writing them up. The following wonderful
people contributed to this letter: Myfanwy ferch Rhiannon, Richenda du
Jardin, Brandubh Ó Donghaile, Hildarun Hügelmann, Roana d'Euvreux,
Cadell Blaidd Dhu, Ailis Linne, and Thomas Ouswood, and Eleanor Vaughn.
Ten people for a commenting group: is that a houseful or what!

Are we doing an April LoI? If so, Myfanwy would *love* to help draw
things. ;-)

General notes: Or should always be capitalized. We know it's a stupid
SCA tradition that bears no resemblence to real blazonry, but it's *our*
tradition.

1. Caroline of Burgundy - Argent, in saltire two epees sable between in
cross four garden roses gules, slipped vert.
Garden roses are not period charges. This would be so much nicer if
they were heraldic roses. But they're still legal. The roses aren't
slipped, they're only barbed
We suggest the blazon: Argent, two epees in saltire sable between in
cross four garden roses gules barbed vert.

2. Charles of Alden Name and device
Azure, a sheaf of arrows inverted a chief enarched inverted rayonne or.
Please capitalize the tincture Or.

Charles is dated to 1273 (Withycombe, s.n. Charles).
Alden (R&W s.n. Alden) is listed as a patronymic surname, not a
locative. We find the argument in the ILOI unconvincing (tracing Haldon
to Haldane -another patronymic/ descriptive byname - to Alden).
Specifically, it is not clear that the transitivity of names goes that
far. It does not follow that because one person could be or
, another person could be or , and a third
person could be or that and are
reasonable variants.

However, there is a similar sounding placename, "Aldon" (R&W s.n.
Aldon), which he could certainly use (which is dated in various
spellings to 1317 and 1321). So either or would be fine.

3. Conrad Longespee the Blak Heart
Sable, two erminois lions dormant, a chief embattled erminois.
Blazon fu: "Sable, two lions in pale dormant and a chief embattled
erminois." The chief is very high and the embattlements very large.
We're amazed that this is clear of conflict!

4. Gareth Kincaid - Device, Name registered August 1999
Per pale argent and sable, on a sun counterchanged, a Celtic cross
counterchanged.
Reblazon: Per pale argent and sable, on a sun a Celtic cross all
counterchanged.
Consider Jennet of Twominds "Per pale argent and sable, a sun in his
splendor throughout of the field, rayed and featured counterchanged."
There is certainly at least 1 CD between these two devices, for the
addition of a tertiary. However, we're not certain if there should be
one for a sun versus a sun throughout (but think not), nor are we sure
if the parts that are not counterchanged are dominant. Given that this
was registered in 1975, we should probably kick it up to Laurel for the
decision (i.e. who knows what it actually looks like).

5. Iago Benitez - 2 new badges
Or, an Eagle statant wings displayed gules within an orle of ermine
spots sable.
We weren't sure how to describe the wing position here, as it's not
really displayed; Myfanwy found something similar in Parker (p. 624),
"wings expansed." So we suggest the blazon: "Or, an eagle rising wings
expansed gules within an orle of ermine spots sable."

Quarterly gules and Or, a cross bottony within a bordure, all
counterchanged.
This looks fine and free from conflict.

6. Isabel de Santiago - New Name
Isabel is listed in Elsbeth Anne Roth (16th c. Female names).
de Santiago is attested in the Catologo as well as in DM (Yuanes de
Santiago 1248) p. 233.
This is a good (no, great!) late period Spanish name!

7. Jolivette du Louvre - Jollivet is found in the Index (which should
have quotes, not underlines - I'd also skip the "Lord" part); adding -te
to a masculine name ending in -et is a normal way of feminizing names in
French . du Louvre is as advertised. The name looks reasonable. ???

8. Joscelyn Odette d'Arques
Gyronny of eight or and argent, two ram's heads combattant azure and
sable.
"Joscelin" is dated to 1199 in Withycombe (s.n. Jocelyn), and "Gosselyn"
to 1327 in R&W (s.n. Jocelyn). So, Joscelyn is a reasonable form,
though it's a masculine name. Odette is listed in Withycombe as "fairly
common in France," though no dated citations are given (s.n. Ottilia).
d'Arques is as cited. Either (a masculine name) or
(a feminine name) should be fine, but the combination
is not acceptable.

Is gyronny of two metals legal??? These heads are not simply
combattant, but with their horns interlaced or maybe entwined.

9.Kaithren Rowand
Kaithren - is dated to 1623 in the mentioned source (in the gray period,
hence registerable). Rowand - this spelling is dated to 1509 and 1550.
By this time, surnames are inherited, and so this probably wouldn't
literally be taken to mean "red-headed." But it's a fine name.

10. Margaret Acton
Margaret is dated in Withycombe to 1093 (s.n. Margaret). Acton is as
cited (though it's nice to cite it as s.n. Acton so we know where to
look on the page).
Azure, a chicken passant contourney a chief engrailed argent.
Consider Rannveigr Haakonardottir: Azure, a falcon counterclose argent.
This is clear, with 1 CD for the chief, and a second for the change in
type of bird.

11. Mary Elizabeth Clason
Mary - (Withycombe, s.n. Mary), dates from the 12th century in England
(earlier in Scotland) and continued to be used through the end of
period. Elisabeth (Withycombe, s.n. Elizabeth) is first found at the
end of the 12th century and continues to be used through the end of
period. Clason is the header form in Black, but there are no period
examples of this spelling. It's registerable, but unlikely, between the
use of the modern form and two given names, which are
unattested in Scots.
Azure, a horseshoe inverted, on a chief Or three round buckles sable.

12. Matthias of Harlech -Name registered August 1999
Per pale sable and argent, on a rondel a human skull all counterchanged.
Consider William of York "Per pale sable and argent, a roundel
counterchanged." There is 1 CD for addition of the tertiary.

13. Muirgen Kincaid - Per chevron inverted sable and argent, a lute
palewise Or and an estoile vert.
These charges are really small, and the chevron could stand to be
sharper. We're not certain that it *has* to be redrawn, but it would be
a good idea.

14. Og, Stronghold of - Og is documented as a personal name (R&W s.n.
Ogg), for example William Og 1369 and Ogge filius Adam 1199. Mills
suggests that placenames from the root 'oak' are written in period with
an 'A' (modern Occold is Acolt in 1086, Ocle Pychard is Acle Pichard in
1242). We can't help them. Og-something would work.

15. Westland Mor, Canton of - Westland is documented in R&W (s.n.
Westland): Sibota Westland 1408. Westmorland would be really nice,
(Mills, s.n. Westmorland).
Per chevron abased azure and vert, a chevron abased argent, in chief a
mullet of four points Or between the horns of a massacre proper, in base
a laurel wreath Or.
Note that the petition needs to include the blazon or emblazon, as well
as the name. This is not a massacre, but rather two stag's horns; to be
a massacre, they ought to be conjoined. The per chevron inverted is so
low that it almost appears to be a point fimbriated. As drawn,
everything except the massacre is too small. It almost appears as if
the massacre is the primary charge - the chevron is far too narrow, and
the mullet far too small.

Catalogo: Romera Iruela, Luis, and Ma. del Carmen Galbis Di/ez,
_Catalogo de Pasajeros a Indias, Siglos XVI, XVII, y XVIII_ (Sevilla:
Archivo General de Indias, 1980).
DM: Diez Melcon, R. P. Gonzalo, _Apellidos Castellano-Leoneses: Siglos
IX-XIII, ambos inclusive_ (Universidad de Granada, 1957).
Elsbeth Anne Roth, _16th-century Spanish Women's Names_ (WWW:
Self-published, 1998)
[URL:http://www.sca.org/heraldry/laurel/names/spanish.html].
R&W: Reaney, P. H., & R. M. Wilson, _A Dictionary of English Surnames_
(London: Routledge, 1991; Oxford University Press, 1995). Sveriges:
Anon., -, _Sveriges Medeltida Personnamn_, Vol. 1-13 (Uppsala:
1967-1999).
Withycombe, E.G., _The Oxford Dictionary of English Christian Names_,
3rd ed. (Oxford: Oxford University Press, 1988).